“Without them, we wouldn’t have become the government”

Suthep [Democrat Party secretary-general] explained to the disappointed Democrat executives that it was one of the conditions sought by the Newin faction in exchange for their support for Abhisit, a party source said. Suthep was quoted as saying that, “Without them, we wouldn’t have become the government.” […]

Many Democrat MPs at the meeting expressed displeasure with certain appointees. (Nation)

“Without them, we wouldn’t have become the government.” This sentence shall be repeated again and over again. Other keywords are “disappointed” and “displeasure”… We will probably hear them again in the future.

The government composition is not official yet, but Transports (blank check on a very fat bank account) and Interior (power) will go to Newin’s friends (the defectors, ex friends of Thaksin).

Abhisit can smile, can give as many interviews as he wishes on CNN, he can speak about “unity” and play the Obama Style, he will not erase this stain. This shameful stain.

He’s the Prime Minister thanks to a Frankenstein Coalition.

21 Responses to ““Without them, we wouldn’t have become the government””


  1. 1 Bedwyr 19 December 2008 at 1:33 am

    Shameful indeed.

    And shameless.

    A quick demise would be appropriate methinks. Starting with Newin.

    Bedwyr

  2. 2 absolutelybangkok 19 December 2008 at 2:34 am

    Nicely put.

    Both CNN and BBC had some talk with Abhisit. Can’t help it, but see how he avoids the obvious facts, questions and conclusions:

    CNN: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLVjZeNAIyE

    BBC: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OA5hDpAsDWk

    The straight questions of both Dan and Jonathan may look impolite for Thais. But with such answers there won’t develop any healthy approaches.

    Let’s give Abhisit four months. Then we shall see.

  3. 3 chinesethai 19 December 2008 at 10:46 am

    I agree that this is shameful.

    And that’s why I like a totally appointed government better from day one.

    I wish that all the elections would be banned for at least 10 years, giving the time to reeducating the Thai society about democracy. Thailand should follow the footsteps of Taiwan, South Korea and Singapore.

  4. 4 Bedwyr 19 December 2008 at 12:40 pm

    @ CT:

    Appointed government? Appointed by whom? The same people who appointed this government?

    Dude, the King is not a part of the solution, he is the biggest part of the problem.

    Bedwyr

  5. 5 chinesethai 19 December 2008 at 3:26 pm

    Bedwyr,

    I disagree. The more the situation unfolds, the less I see the King as the problem.

    In fact, the King disappoints me big time, if he really intervened behind the scene. I am against either the Dems or PTP forming a government now. If possible, I still want an appointed government ruling Thailand with ironfist like Chiang Ching Kuo, Park Chung Hee, and Lee Kwan Yew who ruled Taiwan, South Korea, and Singapore respectively until the people are ready for full-fledged democracy (free elections). Elections should have been banned for at least 10 years.

    I like the way Mainland China is going now at its very own pace. The Thais should have disregarded all the hooha from abroad.

  6. 6 fall 19 December 2008 at 4:29 pm

    I wish that all the elections would be banned for at least 10 years, giving the time to reeducating the Thai society about democracy.
    Burma tried that…

  7. 7 chinesethai 20 December 2008 at 12:41 am

    China and Vietnam also tried that.

    What about the Philippines and Indonesia?

  8. 8 FDL 20 December 2008 at 2:04 am

    We would all be naive if we believe a pretty face Abhisit Vejjajiva with relatively ‘clean’ political record could configure a coalition government without shady characters.

    If the top man in government remains above all the dishonesty and the shadiness, and, would promptly intervene to stop corruptions that would certainly crop up from his ministers and their juniors, and, openly submit to public scrutiny whenever public suspicions of impropriety surface . . . that would make for a fine government. But the government should move briskly ahead to tackle all the many urgent economic and social issues that need prompt attending to.

  9. 9 Bedwyr 20 December 2008 at 3:03 am

    @CT:

    This is a very dangerous line of thought, and if implemented it would rightly make Thailand even more of an international pariah than it is now, and that is what it is because of the meddling of the Palace and the impunity they exercise.

    There is abundant evidence that it is the Palace who have been hindering the implementation of democracy in Thailand, pure and simlpe. The more I have personally read and learned about this situation, the more I have done a 180 degree turn in respect of brother Thaksin. Yes he was a thief, yes he was corrupt, as indeed were all of his coterie, and yes, to be frank, he was and still is, a pig. But you should not forget that he is a product of Thai culture and the Thai system that the King has actively developed for many years. He thought to use the poor as a vehicle for his own elevation and in this he was both strategically shrewd and morally bankrupt.

    Make no mistake about it, Thailand is what Thailand is because the man at the top wants it so, and there is no amount of lying, obfuscation, treachery, propaganda or any of the other traditional Thai tools which will re-conceal that fact. It is increasingly out in the open and the palace is rushing around like a headless chicken trying to find a fig leaf. And I do not believe it is the King making the decisions any more, nr has it been for some months.

    I believe this genie is not going back in the bottle, and that we are in the end game for the ‘Dhammaraja sovereign” pipe-dream.

    The sooner this happens, the sooner the myths and legends from the Palace will be seen to be merely the BS that they are, and the sooner the mainstay of Thailand (the rural poor) can begin getting a fair slice of the national pie. The rich will not go quietly though and I strongly suspect there will be a lot of bloodshed in Thailand before the game is over.

    Will all this ultimately result in democracy? I do not believe so. China has no need of a democracy on its doorstep, nor a ‘Dhammaraja” monarchy. Both ideas are already dead, though more cheerfully, Thailand will fit nicely into the newly capitalist approaches of China. Minus lot of the Bangkok elite.

    Merry Xmas

    Bedwyr

  10. 10 Rockderk the Great 20 December 2008 at 4:27 am

    PM says he’ll present the Dems policies on the 29th and 30th. That’ll give him almost 2 weeks to think one or two up! Which is probably better than a certain young TV presenter-governor wannabe who, when asked what he’d do about the 500 gridlocked Bangkok intersections with PC Therdsaks controlling the traffic light switches said, Duhhhh, we could computerise them, or transfer the police to other duties..(drool). Funny thing is he’s nothing like the worst candidate. That honor (for me at least) goes to the botox queen.

  11. 11 Paso 20 December 2008 at 6:09 am

    The only people people who need re-education in Thailand are the Politicians. Corruption flows from the top down.
    An appointed government just guarantees a pre-selected group will keep their noses in the trough with minimal outside interference.
    Government should serve the people, not it’s self. Unfortunately this is a concept that vast majority of Thai politicians are unable to grasp.

  12. 12 Bedwyr 20 December 2008 at 7:12 am

    Paso.

    Quite right and nicely put.

    It is surely not credible at all that the man who can put a stop to armed conflict with a few chosen words has not the power to make the police or politicians honest, nor to repeal the iniquitous and oppressive lese majeste law. Someone thinks everybody is stupid and gullible, and not just Thais.

    Bedwyr

  13. 13 chinesethai 20 December 2008 at 9:38 am

    Bedwyr,

    Everybody looks and sounds nice to mention the term “rural poor”. But do you really believe that this crisis is about “Elite VS Rural Poor” as they say? I am really enough with that mantra.

    It proves to me that you as well as those westerners who claim themselves indirectly as Thailand pundits/experts don’t know Thailand even a grain of it. You guys try to put your “class struggle theory” learned from your European History class into a culture unfamiliar to you. It makes you guys look increasing ignorant day-by-day.

    Fact is Thailand is totally different from Europe historically and culturally.

    I wish that Mr.Speaker ThaiCrisis would open a special space of sub-blog that we could debate over this silly “Elite VS Rural Poor” notion. And we let Mr.Speaker to moderate it. I’ll prove to you why the West has got it all wrong and that Western way of thought is not universal.

  14. 14 chinesethai 20 December 2008 at 9:46 am

    In the meantime, take a look at Thaksin’s democracy in the making.

    img95.imageshack.us/img95/2966/81526746lm0.gif

  15. 15 ThaiCrisis 20 December 2008 at 9:57 am

    I’m thinking about opening… a forum !
    😉

    I mean seriously, you seem so passionate.

    It’s not very convenient to talk with the “comment” function of WordPress.

  16. 16 whoopla 20 December 2008 at 10:32 am

    Thai Crisis, you should open a blog called Thai Cries for Bedwyr and chinesethai so they can continue their monologues while breaking the springs of your armchairs that they so comfortably recline on. Time for some re-upholstering, TC, and to do that your guests will have to get off the sofa. With a clean slate maybe the old blog can resume talk about whats really going on in this country, like the class struggle between metropolitan elite vs the former electoral stronghold of the rural poor.

  17. 17 Bedwyr 20 December 2008 at 11:46 am

    ChineseThai:

    With respect this is just so much crap. it is time I broke a lance with you as others have done.

    Everybody looks and sounds nice to mention the term “rural poor”. But do you really believe that this crisis is about “Elite VS Rural Poor” as they say? I am really enough with that mantra.

    Just because you don’t like it CT, doesn’t make it untrue. This is essentially a struggle between the monarchists and the democrats (not the party), and they have succeeded in whetting the appetite of the poor. Perhaps you should take the trouble to go up to Isaan and speak to a few hundred people there and see if they think it is a struggle between the haves and the have-nots.

    It proves to me that you as well as those westerners who claim themselves indirectly as Thailand pundits/experts don’t know Thailand even a grain of it. You guys try to put your “class struggle theory” learned from your European History class into a culture unfamiliar to you. It makes you guys look increasing ignorant day-by-day.

    This is again so much crap. The biggest class struggle the world has ever seen took place in India, Latin America and China. It might have escaped your attention but none of those were in Europe, and the 2 biggest of all time were in Asia. For Gods sake man, listen to yourself and get a grip.

    Fact is Thailand is totally different from Europe historically and culturally“.

    So? is this more of the same “foreigners don;t understand Thais” bullshit? You might like to think that Thais are complex and inscrutable but that is just hogwash. The rich are just pigs with their snouts in the trough, same as you find anywhere but more so because they have been encouraged by sloppy governance (in turn encouraged by the King), and the poor are peasants. Nothing very complex anywhere in that.

    I wish that Mr.Speaker ThaiCrisis would open a special space of sub-blog that we could debate over this silly “Elite VS Rural Poor” notion. And we let Mr.Speaker to moderate it. I’ll prove to you why the West has got it all wrong and that Western way of thought is not universal“.

    Yes, I thought it was more of the ‘westerners don’t understand us Thais’ crap.

    Boring son, very boring.

    Bedwyr

  18. 18 ray 20 December 2008 at 1:43 pm

    paso is correct. the politians need a crash course. the public has already graduated from the university of rajdamnon. whether u agree or disagree with pad they have made available info that was never gonna see light of day under thaksin regime.
    in thailand corruption is accepted. commission 10% 20% 25% no problem. but not f****** 300%.!!
    just the building of suvanabhumi airport and u can see what the thaksinand his cronies have done.
    what about mr somchai lilapaichit? the lawyer who is missing ? wiining an election does not mean u can do what the hel u want? thats what thaksin, veera etc need to learn. ask them any question about corruption,ese majeste,their reply is ” we came thru election”.
    i personally think thailand was better before thaksin and will be even better without thaksin.
    as for the rural poor westerners are so worried about today they have massive personal debt due to thaksin policy of transfer yr property to capital. translation; mortgage yr farms and land and spend the monies on mobile phones,pick up trucks and stuff u really dont need.
    i still believe thaksin would still be in power if he paid taxes on the shares sold to temasek. that was the straw that broke the camel back!

  19. 19 fall 20 December 2008 at 3:20 pm

    @ChineseThai
    …I’ll prove to you why the West has got it all wrong and that Western way of thought is not universal.
    That’s quite a challenge, and I am afraid I’m not up to the task. World geo-politic history is not exactly my specialty.
    Free speech is good because it enable discussion, such as what’s been going on here. Discussion promote understanding, which lead to conclusion or at the very least, concrete disagreement.

    Whether everyone here agree or not matter. What matter is the idea and debate up there. But when discussion degenerate to insult and personal ego, that’s when things like the Holocaust, the Great Leap, and certain law(cough-cough) flourish…

  20. 20 chinesethai 20 December 2008 at 3:58 pm

    Bedwyr,

    Just admit politely that you can’t accept my challenge. It is not wrong for a farang to do so to an Asian.

  21. 21 Bedwyr 21 December 2008 at 2:49 am

    @CT:

    “Just admit politely that you can’t accept my challenge.”
    If that were the case CT, I would have no problem admitting so. I have no face to keep, I have no appearance to maintain at all costs, I have no precious facade. I am not a Thai for whom all these trivial things are paramount in order to maintain a fictional self-image.

    It just is not the case.

    I have no wish to fall out with anyone and so I will quietly withdraw from this thread. If you believe you have a point, then good for you. I believe your pov is shallow, naive and facile.

    But you are entitled to it.

    Bedwyr


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Thailand Crisis

Coup, Economic slowdown, Terror In the South... The situation is worsening in Thailand. Bumpy road like often before.

But this time, it's different.

The key to understand the present turmoil is the inevitable... succession of King Bhumibol.


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